Sunday, March 24, 2013

"Seth cultists"

I've finally found the source for Tom Dark's quotation of Seth referring to New Agers as "imbecilic personalities" and their gatherings as "psychic sideshows."  (Arguably, I would have found it sooner had I looked for it sooner.)  The content was included in an unpublished Seth session that the "Reality Change" publication refused to print. (I remember being somehow associated with "Reality Change" in the '90s, and I received some unpublished sessions along with a certificate signed by Robert Butts, for joining the organization.) This session may already be published now in the multi-volume sessions and notes.  This earthiness is not uncharacteristic of Seth's unedited talks that are revealed in these non-published sessions; still, I hope it's published eventually, because I can't agree with it more.

The major "paranormal" shows tend to shun Seth scholarship for some reason. I remember only one "Coast" show devoted to Seth.  This is probably because Seth scholarship has nothing in common with the New Age or the paranormal, and paranormal investigators somehow intuit this.

I stumbled upon this while trying to find information on Sue Watkins' "25th Anniversary Edition" of "Conversations With Seth."  I have the paperback; I'd like the Kindle version. But for some reason, it's been split into two parts.  Has material been added to this "deluxe edition" sufficient to warrant the extra cost?


  1. i actually interviewed Sue Watkins in 2005. I can post it on YouTube if you'd like to hear it. The sound quality is not that great but with headphones you can hear it pretty well. I learned a lot about the Seth books over the years. Marlon

  2. It was in the spring of '87, I talked Sue Watkins into paying Rob a call (she complained about him and Jane very frequently, and I tend to doubt she'd have ever visited him again if not for me). Laurel showed me that excerpt of the Seth Session and told me that Maude Cardwell had refused to print it. Maude Cardwell was, at the time, hosting a lot of charlatans. "Talk to me about anything you want," quote Peter somebody, now deceased,"just pay me my sixty dollars an hour."

    On the coffee table of the "hill house" living room was a complaint about Ricky Stack from some people in Australia. They felt he was a fraud and they wanted their money back -- from Rob, of course.

    When I met Ricky for the first time I listened to him a little while and then told him he had no business "teaching Seth" and never should. He replied that Seth approved of his "teaching." That was a lie.

    Never underestimate the gullibility of the American people.

    1. First of all, let me say that I'm just very amazed that you knew both Sue Watkins and Robert Butts. I've read Sue Watkins' books. They are good. She and Jane clashed. I probably would have sympathized with Sue, however. Jane was a profoundly intelligent but troubled individual. Her childhood was harsh beyond description, and her intelligence and insight were unfortunately not enough to allow her to tame her inner demons. Which makes the Seth material all the more amazing, in that context. Still, I'm not sure how I would have handled Jane Roberts, the person. (I probably would have reacted defensively like Sue did.). I would've still gone to her "ESP class," though.

      Probably, I've been as much influenced by Robert Butts as I've been by Seth. It was his calm, assured commentary that *made* the Seth books. Because there was a level-headed Robert Butts not only transcribing, but evaluating, the material, I was able to suspend my disbelief enough to consider the material--which would have been uncomfortably radical if presented in any other context.

      So. Should the participants in Jane's classes now scatter to the four parts of the world, bearing witness to the teachings that they have received, and bringing forth the Good News? My first thought is, "This has been tried before, with mixed results." My hunch is that "Seth" would probably say, "No."

  3. Heh! Kept this up on my browser, for some reason. Must've been for you.

    I may as well say it point blank: Susan M. Watkins was absolutely the most unpleasantly neurotic individual with whom I'd ever come within three feet. I've even had the displeasure of viewing those famous hemorrhoids.

    Sue's childhood wasn't anywhere near "harsh." I looked at her memoir and saw these same stories she'd repeated to me over and over again -- to the point I dreaded talking to her, because almost anything I said would "remind her of a story" -- blaming her dad for hemorrhoids, fearing the furniture would eat her up, mom doing the crossword puzzle with a ballpoint pen, the same old stuff, on and on and ON -- and I saw in her book how she'd changed them.
    She never had any "inner demons." That's embarrassing.

    Well, look. I could go on and on and on myself. Particularly about her jaw-droppingly weird terror of children. To some degree I have a duty about it, people who have come to idealize, even revere Sue Watkins need to understand it a whole lot better than they do. I'm very well known for my honesty and detail in reporting, which I did for awhile. Sue was fired for reporting on a meeting she never attended, and snickered about it. I witnessed first hand and up-close-editor how she'd change details or get them wrong.

    Seth's comments to her were plenty accurate. I never realized how understated they were. Sue's "hard life" was a result of the rich-kid disease of trying to "justifying one's existence." I'd seen it before. I can't feel real sorry for it.

    As to the ESP class students, I have a similar duty. Better yet, those who've taken Seth's work seriously, USE it, have a duty to stop paying these boys who've made sideshow freaks of themselves, "world's top experts" and all that appalling hype. They're so smart? Well let's see them make a million or two without sucking on the gullible who'll pay good money to few them and listen to their wearisome stories. I did.

    That info is there for EVERYBODY. I know soooo few people who've taken advantage of it. But they're there. Those few aren't out wheeling around charging dumbasses fees to view their carcasses.

    About all this, Jane said "If I knew this was going to happen, I'd never have started in the first place." It's in DEVF in Rob's notes.

    I had this guy put this up years ago. It's still pretty much what I think:

    1. Actually I was referring to Jane's childhood as harsh... I really don't know much about Sue Watkins aside from what she's written about Jane.